Message #4318

[Jitendra Hydonus]

Steve,

I must ask you, as I have not seen these Four Noble Truths before. Where did they come from, if you know ? Seems I have missed many things. The " where they came from " is not of major importance, but seems the person who made these statements seems down on life in general, especially with that first statement.

I disagree with the first statement, " life means suffering ". Saying it like this , makes it sound like that this is all there is to life. Yes, there is suffering in life, but there is also joy. At times it seems certain people of certain religious/ spiritual paths, seem to only see, or to look for the suffering in life - it is almost like they feel " guilty " if they feel something besides suffering.

God grant me the patience to change the things I can. The knowledge to know what I cannot change and the wisdom to know the difference.

words of wisdom, thanks

in Divine Friendship,
Spirit fox

It was witten by the Buddha

Suffering arises from the fact that we want things to be different then the way they are. There are somethings we cannot change. Like the morning traffic or the weather. When we react to these things we are causing suffering to ourselves. Because we are attached to how things should be rather than how they are. If you have ever had a loved one die or have had someone you cared about dearly, leave you; Then ask yourself if you suffered. We must be honest with ourselves here. As long as we see ourselves as the body and not spirit we identify with that which is imperfect. Because we have a dim memory of our soul and we want everything to be perfect like the soul; we suffer. The Buddha never said that there was not joy in life. He wanted to take away the root cause of suffering, which is attachment, so that joy could be felt. That ultimate joy that is found in enlightenment and not temporary joy. We must be careful to differentiate the difference between pain and pleasure and joy which is beyond these dualities.

The Buddha being in permanent bliss and joy tried to remove suffering for others. He recognized the suffering that most of us feel  Having the joy he experienced, he recognized the suffering that most of us feel. You see some people get used to living in a prison cell after years and years. Some birds are reluctant to fly once the cage door is open. In the same way some of us think that we are happy until things don't work out the way we want them too. Then we realize that suffering is part of life. Yet there is a way to remove this suffering. The Buddha came to help those who wanted this to occur in their lives.

Why is it that someone who is trying to help us attain a state of permanent bliss is associated with thinking that everything is suffering? Life is filled with suffering and moments of happiness also. But often these states of happiness are only temporary. It is like being on a see saw. One moment happy the next not. The Buddha saw this see saw experience as still living with suffering. He had a lasting solution not temporary.

Speaking of guilt: This to me is a totally different topic uniquely associated with Christianity. i think it stems from the idea of eternal heaven and hell and that we feel guilty if we do not live up to certain standards. To some extent people who have a conscience would feel guilty if they did something wrong. However feeling we are doomed to eternal hell without a chance to come back and right some of our mistakes, in this life or the next, leads to this guilt. i feel much more than suffering when i meditate. If you have tried meditating for any extended amount of time with some good techniques~there would be no need for guilt. Or to even consider this absurdity. This is a religion of fire and brimstone and eternal damnation it is something of the past. We have moved way beyond this and these kind of people. It is no sense talking with them about their old concepts of religion. How can you explain principles of trigonometry to someone who doesn't understand the basic principles of addition and subtraction? Move on Spirit Fox. These kind of people will only hold you back. They eat up your time arguing about the Bible when they could be meditating and experiencing bliss. i only speak to you about it because i hope that you are beyond such ignorance. This is one reason i am happy to be out of the ignorance of the Bible Belt.

The soul is ever new bliss; not to be confused with sorrow or any concepts you or any other people may have that identifies themselves with guilt and suffering. In the consciousness of spirit all seems right in the moment and the darkness of the past is washed away by the morning Sun of divine happiness!

Jitendra