Spiritual Portal

It appears we have had some members leave here and attacked this site after leaving. Their contention was that politics were not a spiritual matter. Although politics shouldn’t take the place of spirituality or religion, it is clear that various politicians have been used in history for spiritual purposes. Among these were Gandhi, Arjuna, Lincoln, Mandela, Jesus and Navalny. They have used their office or position for spiritual purposes. There are also many other political leaders who have used their political position and power for very demonic purposes.

Politics indeed plays a part in the cosmic movie. But as spiritual aspirants, we are not required to take positions or even to listen to politicians. I cannot resist seeing this part of the cosmic movie unfold though, and remain amazed at how much unreasonable ideology is touted around.

In response to the above Paramahansa Yogananda did say that ‘it is our responsibility to vote in free elections.’ So I would glean by this statement that he also thought it was our responsibility to know what we are voting for or against. If and when I see the quote I will let you know.

Lucca (mccoy) ;

It is of interest to me that you use the word ‘unreasonable’ to describe ideological differences. My concern is really in ‘truth’. I see the differences in people - not a ideology so much - which makes a difference in character of statesmen. In this way I see our mental attitude differs. Yours appears to be more focused on practicality; that is what works most smoothly, and mine on facts verses fiction; who is truthful? Our paradigmatic approach often intrigues me. As it gives me a better understanding of the fundamental differences people have in relationships as well.

To me a person can be left wing and honest or dishonest or conversely a person can be right wing and honest or dishonest….. With varying degrees of fabrication and integrity.

I agree with the above, although I can mention ideologies which have no logic, or are are just about fallacies from both sides.

Fuhrer Trump's ideology: There is no global warming, it's all made up.

The Woke ideology (supported by many showbiz people and entrepreneurs): there is no biological gender in nature, you are encouraged to change according to your whims.

After a lifetime of being more left wing than right I now am settled with the need for different approaches. The left wing government in my state in Australia has accrued more debt than all the other states put together. Sure the infrastructure was needed but the debt is almost insurmountable. The conservatives will get in next election, cut the public services by a long way and eventually, probably when debt is a lot more manageable, the other side will be brought back to help with progressing the state again.

A single question can have many answers...so the need for different approaches in politics, religion, probably everything...

It’s quite different in our country. The right wing political party under Reagan and Trump produced the largest debt. With Reagan he over tripled the debt and Trump (though he promised to bring down the debt)  both gave the rich the largest tax brakes in history. And as a result both right ring presidents incurred most of the largest debts of any presidents.  In fact a more left wing government during Clinton produced years of surplus government budgets. And Clinton explained it in the short video below with one word; arithmetic.

https://www.propublica.org/article/national-debt-trump

https://youtu.be/AX3a-2yrQwY?si=1B9mGvqkIpG_68R3

Okay, then, it seems as though one side is all good, the other all bad even though that idea seems redundant in its application to unenlightened humanity. You live in a democracy so you'll get the government you need or deserve, maybe both? In fact isn't that true for every facet of our lives?

I wouldn’t go that far. I find some right wing politicians have some high ethical standards. Much higher than some left wing ones. The main difference is they mostly seem to think that they as individuals can do a better job than the government. However it’s gotten way out of hand, with a handful of them having more wealth than 50% of the population. I’m seeing Amma right now. She has given some 1.8 billion dollars in aid to the homeless, indigent and disaster relief since 1985 (to only name a few of her accomplishments) . She is a model of how the individual is more venerable than governments. Although she is a Master. She has also made comments about how wealth can lead to great selfishness and spiritual impoverishment. I think there is a lot to be said about the spiritual principle that to those who have much is required.

There are those among us who have little economically yet we find ourselves blessed in the presence of spiritual affluence. Some of us may not find our desires as important as the needs that we have been provided with to transform ourselves.

https://us.amma.org/global-charities/community-outreach

Yes it is web; every facet of life! I do believe we have also received the government we deserve. And; I’m willing to point it out. And agree with you on that point. Furthermore we get the people we deserve. So in fact it is “true for every facet of our lives”. Also this would extend to a personal view of our relationships here at the portal; as spiritual seekers must also accept the reality that the Gurus have in mind certain spiritual lessons for the people he/she brings together. So in that sense I accept the view that we are learning and growing in our self unfoldment through the contrasting views of those which the Gurus have surrounded us.


What is “unreasonable ideology” to those with less principle is simply spiritual dedication and statesmanship to another. And those who have no spiritual background often echo a senseless weakness and compliance to practical solutions for moral decisions of a spiritual nature. There have been spiritual ideologies brought into the political sphere by such notable people as Gandhi freeing India, Navalny pointing out that there are other views than Putin’s, Lincoln demanding the end of slavery who took an absolute position in the face of more practical people willing to compromise ideals.

Mccoy, I see your decision to take care of your son as your strong conviction, although i cannot say how I would have responded with your set of circumstances. We all take a stand in our views, some of us are tested much more than others. We may never know our own limitations and willful determinations until we face the opposition of those who have no faith or moral fiber and faint in the face of circumstances. Which brings up the question; can we compromise with a sociopath? I pray for friends such as you and web (above) and for your happiness and spiritual growth and discernment. Some of us aim to take a strong view as Churchill once said;

“Kites rise highest against the wind and not with it”

Winston Churchill was a maverick and sorely needed when the rest of the politicians declared Hitler was no threat, and wanted Parliament to break for the summer. He indeed 'sang the song none had sung' as our dear chant Divine Gypsy says. And he was Napoleon in his previous life according to Master. Swami Ram Tirtha says that Napoleon had attained a degree of transcendence through the force of his will. He says the same of Lord Byron who others scoff at for being immoral. Anyone who can defy the restrictive voice of the ego and push beyond limitations the ego imposes is on the way to mastery. I'm sure our own Master would agree as he had great admiration for Swami Ram Tirtha.

Web; I have attempted to decipher the intent of your comments here. I do not know much about Swami Ram Tirtha, but perhaps you will inform us. I remember chanting ‘Marching Light’ ; quite a long chant for Yogananda’s.

I hadn’t heard of Masters claim about Winston Churchill but I can see how a man like Napolean would understand the mentality of another persons greed for power; it takes one to know one. And I would say the same of Putin. His insatiable greed for power has led him into dangerous waters as it did Napolean. I am also happy to see you have temporarily led the direction of the latest developments here in the U.S. with some of those pertaining to the other side of the globe. Although I will assure you my points regarding Winston Churchill were intended to show the austerity and grit of the English people with the stubbornness of his leading power which eventually led to the demise of Nazi Germany and the collapse of communism there as well. Perhaps he learned something in the life of Napolean; the will directed for the wrong goals can teach someone the limitations of the egos desire for power. I only want to make the reminder that Putin is just another power hungry human being like Hitler and Napolean and he was a communist as a KGB agent for those power hungry people as well.

https://yoganandasite.wordpress.com/2017/01/20/cosmic-chant-swami-ram-tirthas-song-ram-tirthas-life-and-teachings/


One of RamaTirtha‘s poems, titled “Marching Light” appeared in Yogananda’s book of Hindu chants Cosmic Chants as “Swami Ram Tirtha‘s Song.” PARAMAHANSA YOGANANDA: God has given you the power to dynamite all your troubles. “Beware O ye mountains, stand not in my way! Your ribs will be shattered and tattered today!”

Yes I know the chant well, now known as 'Swami Ram Tirtha's Song' in the chant book.

The Divine works through the ego's of the unenlightened bringing about the balance of infinite karma at play in creation. Hitler and Putin I will agree manifest so much dark qualities and not much light. Napoleon on the other hand is poorly portrayed in our 'modern world' in my opinion. One thing of note is that he championed the cause of the public library, an industry my wife worked in for many years. Yes his wars caused much death and destruction but without him I'm sure things would have gone down many darker corridors. I'm no expert on Napoleon but have read enough to suggest the man brought about necessary change.

The man's ability to compartmentalize is also quite legendary. Once in the middle of a battle one of his officers was passing by Napoleon watching the enemy movements like a hawk. Napoleon stopped his observations and called the officer over. He told him that it had come to his attention that the officer was seen in the local city with a young female the night before. He berated him as the officer was a married man and Napoleon didn't like him discrediting the rank and uniform.

Web;

I’m not much of a moralist but I do know that putting yourself in the position of a sexual frenzy can make it very difficult to still the body. Practicing Kriya actually numbs the body as the energies are brought into the spine. I’m not sure how Solomon satisfied all his wives and concubines or if his story is just that; a story. I know it is important in the spiritual life to calm the body and not always put it in a state of frenetic activity.

Not only unreasonable ideology dear friend but unreasonable appointees. Donald Trump has appointed 13 billionaires as his designated advisors. Let us see if more than a dozen billionaires have any intention of sharing with the rest of the world the money they have hoarded to themselves, or making policies to share with others, since Donald Trump is already associated with giving some of the largest tax breaks in history to the rich, while causing huge separations in economic disparity in the world. It is quite a comparison that Trump has with Jesus Christ who appointed most of his disciples of comparably humble economic backgrounds. But the again we are not speaking of a man with any humbleness associated with his character in a Donald Trump so how can we associate any humility to a country with such an appointed leader?

23 Then Jesus said to his disciples, “Truly I tell you, it is hard for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of heaven. 24 Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God.”
Matthew 19:23-24 NIV

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/here-are-the-13-billionaires-trump-has-tapped-for-top-administration-roles/ar-AA1w3oXS?ocid=BingNewsSerp

In the Ramayana, Rama's father, King Dasharatha also had many wives, 350 if I remember right, and that story comes from way before Solomon I believe. For most of us 'mere mortals', moderation is the very least needed for higher spiritual states, but so is being faithful to only one and neither are easy for many coming out of an age of 'over-indulgence.' I think for Solomon and for Dasharatha, they had already attained a high level of advancement so maybe it's a matter of 'horses for courses'?

It may be just that, they had to live the life of great kings in the Kali Yuga,

Or, it may be that the recounts are metaphorical exaggerations. Probably, the number of wives represented great material wealth and power.

Steve, at this point I must say that, and I find this is the right thread.

Are politics a spiritual matter? NO

Are we entitled to discuss politics as spiritual aspirants? YES, since it is part of the cosmic movie made to entertain us.

Now, Steve, a question which is meant for your own good and the good of this portal. This is a spiritual portal. You have been writing hundreds, or perhaps thousands of posts on a person that you have repeatedly affirmed is not spiritual at all, is a dishonest, Egomaniac, convicted felon, similar to Hitler: Mr Trump. I remember it well, you have been complaining about him and his unspiritual qualities for 8 years, continuously, since the beginning of his first mandate.

The logic would suggest that in this 'spiritual portal' we should not focus too much on such unspiritual people.

Maybe we should try and see the good in such unspiritual people, hoping that the grace of God will uplift them and enlighten them for the good of the whole world.

Slinging our harsh judgments towards political leaders without a pause is maybe more suited to political portals, of which I believe there are many kinds around, for al tastes and political orietations.

In all respects of your views mccoy I have never used any defamity
against the man but only have watched the movies as you have and observed the villain and the saints running in the reels.

I have thought they were always entertaining to you. Let us not forget that Master loved to watch cowboy and Indian shows and brought some of his nuns and monks with him but they too didn’t enjoy the shows.

No doubt some people felt Jesus made harsh judgments as well when the money changers turned his house into a dungeon of thieves. Would we say he was somewhat obsessed about them by overturning the tables and driving them out? After all they were in a ‘spiritual’ temple! I really see no complaints just observing the show and chuckling along at what a fool the Don has made all his followers into.

We can look at it from a different angle; that is since you have been defending so vehemently perhaps you have a compulsion to do so that has become an obsession. I am not here to judge but only to observe. And I’m sure that Lincoln seemed obsessed about freeing the slaves as I also have strong convictions to free the economic slaves that for instance Trump and Musk have deligently worked towards having a dream come true for them.

Steve, I appreciate your arguments, but perhaps we can obsess about movie characters as well. I may hate a villainous character in the last film I saw (or netflix series), but sure my mind won't return back and back again to such a character. Otherwise, maybe it starts being an obsession proper. Did Yogananda obsess about the evil Indians he saw in the old Wild West films? I doubt it, at least, if he did obsess, he didn't show it. Did he obsess about characters in the cosmic movie? I do not remember about it.

Your observation about Jesus can be construed as the fact that you believe you have a God-ordained mission, that of unmasking this evil political character. I do not object to your mission, but a more pertinent place to carry out such a crusade would probably be a political forum, not a spiritual portal.

Steve, politics is one of those sensitive matters that are best avoided in a forum that is not specifically devoted to politics. It is strongly divisive. Everyone believes he or she is adhering to the right sphere of thought. Which is impossible. It's a pitfall, a trap built by Satan.

For now I'm choosing not to open any threads where I see 'Trump' or anything that alludes to politics. Not interested any longer. Not wanting to look like I have an obsession myself, maybe you are right and if so this is the time to nip this mental tendency in the bud.

However, if this almost endless repetition about this unspiritual, uninspiring political character goes on, I may be tempted to take a temporary leave of absence from the forum, maybe...

In all do respect to you my dear friend you must do as you feel your values lead you. The cold heartedness of Donald Trump is so apparent in this man and always has been he holds no place in the heart of America and after seeing this if you still think he does then my well wishes are for you…
 
https://youtu.be/DYUwK6uwxWM?si=x3NkEESz4Ui39IEm

“We have the fate of dignity in our hands’

~Abraham Lincoln a man ‘obsessed’ with abolishment of slavery that help change the world.

https://youtu.be/1qjtugr2618?si=SOOZQP8ZgPPpld_0

I see interest in a wide variety of subjects on this site. At times in history people devote their lives to the cause of freedom, decency and the pursuit of happiness. Meditation and the search for spiritual awakening are the main procedures for such goals. Many individuals however have lived their lifetime that have devoted their lives to the pursuit of happiness and have persistently sought to be an instrumentality of such goals for the happiness of others as well. When we have this happening, it at times works out in the political sphere as well. And people dedicate their whole lives to this process. They may or may not express it as a spiritual journey. However their lives reflect it in their life’s actions. We can see this in the life of Alexia Navalny, Jesus Christ, Amma, Kara-Murza, Abraham Lincoln and many others whom sacrificed their life in the name of justice and yes an obsession with a goal of making the lives of others more happy. You may say that their life’s purpose was not spiritual but rather political. I simply say they were unselfish and lived a spiritual life whether you want to say they we’re obsessed with for instance; stopping the injustice of Putin or the political injustice of the Sanhedrin during the time of Christ.

Nobody is censoring anyone one else here. I’ve let people post what they want as long as it is with decency and doesn’t belittle other members and express anger towards other members. We are all entitled to make our own decisions and evaluations of other people’s behavior as long as it is not belittling their character. I believe that I have been courteous and respectful to others here at the portal. If someone feels I have not; Please let me know and we will attempt to discuss it as spiritual beings.

“Your observation about Jesus can be construed as the fact that you believe you have a God-ordained mission, that of unmasking this evil political character. I do not object to your mission, but a more pertinent place to carry out such a crusade would probably be a political forum, not a spiritual portal.

-mccoy “

I believe the most important mission we have as spiritual seekers is to change ourselves. However friends have told me instead of running away from the problems of your country.. attempt to change them. As you know Krishna did not console Arjuna to join a political rally but rather to fight injustice. And Jesus openly confronted his own spiritual community. He did not engage in open dialogue and debate.

I see the problems today are not being answered by our current president and his selected appointees. The solutions they are giving to current problems are not promising. We have already seen the tax breaks for the wealthy in place before and the so called ‘trickle down theory’ never happened the trickle valve was essentially turned off. We have seen the results of more fracking and oil drilling in the damages to wild life and and our natural environment. There is time we can longer look to the past to solve todays problems. That will not happen with todays leaders. Who will speak for our Mother Earth? Who will speak for the impoverished multitude?

This is surely not the issue, the issue in my opinion is going overboard with a single subject. And I strongly doubt that complaining about the POTUS in this forum will change a minuscule thing in 'real life'.
Sorry if I sound like I'm criticizing your dharma, but again, this is hardly the place to be a political activist.

You are always welcome to your opinions friend. At one time not so long ago we had up to 58,000 guests on here so it wasn’t as if we had no influence. But big business along with Donald Trump and his billionaire friends stepped on us recently.

I know there are people here who feel we have gone overboard on some subjects. But there are other people who’ve been members here that left because there was too much emphasis on spiritual growth and development. An important member left because of ‘Trumpster fans’. At one time the site was called Music and Meditation then it evolved to Soul Searching forum. Finally it’s name is now spiritualportal and I remember a member leaving when the sites name was changed and who kept trying to convince me the name change was a bad choice. You can’t please everyone dear Brother mccoy.

Steve, I think I can agree that this is a game, and commenting the cosmic movie is fun.

So, I'm going to take some liberties here, and please remember that this is a game and I'm just having fun, even as you are having fun constantly hammering Mr. Trump and his cohort of friends.

But Steve, buddy, 58000 guests! Are you being serious? Do you really believe those numbers are physical guests? If so, I have the obligation to warn you that that's a serious illusion, that's a wrong sphere of thought to believe that this is a popular forum. This forum is even very hard to find by search engines.

No way, dewey, LOL, 58000 guests, Steve, if serious, let's pray: deliver us from illusion....deliver us from illusion....deliver us from illusion....deliver us from illusion....deliver us from illusion....deliver us from illusion....

For your games play… yes I said up to 58,000 take a look 👀… I can’t put that number there! I’m merely saying that we had thousands of guests a day at one time not long ago. And I’ve been around long enough to watch that number increase by the month and year since this site was created. So no I do not think are spiritual messages are futile. And even if we keep below 10  guests because of big business and our current government oligarchy we still have an important message to spread. It’s good to have humility but it’s bad to continually underestimate our worth and influence on others and as messengers of light. One light can bring light to a dark place.

Have faith, have faith, deliver us from skepticism, deliver from doubt all obstacles can be overcome and grace is with us always! Let not the darkness of maya cloud our souls destiny and ultimate fate!
 🙏